tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7349070.post8044488650668786026..comments2023-08-29T05:36:46.228-06:00Comments on cyber spirit cafe: "The ELCA has left us"? Not exactlyDoug Kingshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12830571125611956474noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7349070.post-64510767914643867952009-12-21T23:31:50.364-07:002009-12-21T23:31:50.364-07:00You all have no clue. Read it and weap. http://w...You all have no clue. Read it and weap. http://www.exposingtheelca.com/Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7349070.post-52500823878654717132009-12-18T07:23:17.538-07:002009-12-18T07:23:17.538-07:00How is it possible that "their leaving can on...How is it possible that "their leaving can only help the ELCA to finally get a coherent sense of its identity and mission"?? Lacking certain knowledge of which way society's wind will blow in the next five years or five weeks, the ELCA would seem to have no idea what they'll believe or promote at any point in time.Marknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7349070.post-79356759910894711102009-11-21T10:06:56.881-07:002009-11-21T10:06:56.881-07:00As an ELCA pastor, for a little while anyway, what...As an ELCA pastor, for a little while anyway, what both William and Holly said disturb me.<br /><br />True, many larger churches are leaving. But not true, many are entertainment or pastor based. The church I serve, one of the largest in the nation, has three out of four services every weekend that are traditional and use Lutheran hymns and organ.<br /><br />So, actually most, if not many, of the larger churches are this way. And to say "take your stinking money and go " is not Christlike at all. <br /><br />Finally, this is not about larger churches, it is about the many, many (thousands, actually) of smaller churches that will close because of this. At a minimum 15% of this church is gone forever, either by people just walking, or churches closing and denominations laying off folks. It is about those faithful people who have seen their church hijacked by small special interest groups who spent millions to force this vote. <br /><br />In the last study in 2007, sixty percent of the laity was opposed to this. Why was this done?<br /><br />And actually, LCMS and LCMC are different. LCMC ordains women because their is scriptural support for that, unlike this issue. For the church of sola scriptura, a bad time.<br /><br />We are in a post denominational era. This just hastened the end for the ELCA. Historically, it will still be alive for another five to ten years, and then be a failed thirty year experiment . The future is in local mission and ministry, and a church that doesn't vote on divisive social issues.jcrwildernesshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03131834511676767960noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7349070.post-45432834562358188652009-11-16T13:06:49.519-07:002009-11-16T13:06:49.519-07:00The devil loves to use righteous hate to steal the...The devil loves to use righteous hate to steal the hearts of men and women and drive them from the love of Jesus Christ. But those of us left in the ELCA must provoke people to love again and show that love is stronger than hate and only though the power of our lord and by grace are we welcome into the arms of our heavenly father.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11673256323277270392noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7349070.post-30099020642162312052009-11-14T09:38:45.729-07:002009-11-14T09:38:45.729-07:00While I do not agree with the pastor that you are ...While I do not agree with the pastor that you are quoting, my heart hurts due to the manner in which the opposing side is responding. I feel a deep and profound sadness. There is one body in Christ and it is being further mutilated. I will not rejoice over it. I am certain that the devil is rejoicing over the split and I will not side with him.Tricianoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7349070.post-54539174768077749842009-11-13T22:17:52.507-07:002009-11-13T22:17:52.507-07:00Well said, Doug and Holly.
I grew up LCA in the c...Well said, Doug and Holly.<br /> I grew up LCA in the conservative/Republican western suburbs of Chicago. The congregation was former-ULCA, and my family roots were former-Augustana. I first deeply understood the significance of that when I got to LSTC. But I wasn't alone in feeling "at home" there. A dear friend, who grew up in the ALC at a former "Wartburg Synod" congregation felt far more "at home" at LSTC than at the Haugian college in Minnesota she had attended.<br />This issue has, indeed, been infecting the ELCA since before it was formed. Serving in NW MN (approx. 5:1 ALC:LCA, ALC overwhelmingly Haugian) at the time the ELCA was forming, both my congregational members and I were subject to taunts from local LCMS and ALC laypersons and pastors about being a part of the "homo" church. <br />But I also need to say that, while the trend definitely seems to go in that direction, the issue is not solely former ALC-based, nor is it merely Midwestern. A look at the list of those who signed "An Open Letter to the Voting Members<br />of the 2009 ELCA Churchwide Assembly" from CORE bears witness.<br />Perhaps where US Lutheranism is headed is a long-needed realignment, which, unfortunately, will come at great cost to those at Higgins Road and in the parishes who are personally affected. <br />In that regard (and I engage in pure speculation here) is it mere coincidence that "LCMC" differs from "LCMS" by just one letter?Williamnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7349070.post-55463620008778544692009-11-13T18:31:52.683-07:002009-11-13T18:31:52.683-07:00"Take your stinkin money and go!" That a..."Take your stinkin money and go!" That about sums it up, Holly. Thanks for cutting to the chase. (And you're right, Midwestern Lutheranism is a different breed from what you knew out East.)Doug Kingshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12830571125611956474noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7349070.post-64731992926976042582009-11-13T18:09:16.116-07:002009-11-13T18:09:16.116-07:00Wow, I so agree and have for a long time. When I ...Wow, I so agree and have for a long time. When I moved from the northeast to the Midwest I experienced Lutheran culture shock. Where the heck did all these fundamentalists come from. It seems also that the largest congregations leaving are of the mega church model and are very Pastor centered, many have abandoned Lutheran liturgy in favor of an entertainment model. Take your stinkin money and go !Holly Hansenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11015413471952353899noreply@blogger.com